Markdown lines 49–350 · Part 1 of 2
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Bee Something like that that can be brought back to this physical
reality and put in application.
JL: There are many illustrations along that line. I suppose I told
you about this. In Brazil one of the individuals described some beetles
from the Amazon in a particular completely dry area, different from the
normal Amazon area. There are beetles there without wings yet these
beetles levitate themselves to get from one place to another. There
are here and there many illustrations which parrallel the antigravity
type of thing.
RM: Yes. Do they do it by hopping?
“JL: No. He declared that they had nothing to do with hopping or
that sort of thing. That whole area is a very dry area and has some
type of unusual effects on it and he claimed that it was because of
the extra gravitational influences that the beetle was able to control
this. I just brought this up by chance.
RM: The question is. Can we reach deeper or beyond ourselves to find
whether this is a practical application. In other words, again the
selection of subject.
Jk: Yes. The selection of subject keeps bothering me in a way.
Because I don't think you can go along and select, "I would like to
have the answer to that and I would like to have the answer to this..."
It is more or less tuning into a particular area. Straight questions
are hard to answer as such when one asks the question because one doesn't
know what is in the mind of the person asking the question. One has
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tg, seek out his mind first and normally you don't find anything there.
If the person that is asking the question has really a subgect in
in his mind rather than having an answer thrown to him like going to
a fortune teller, If he really has something that he is interested
in, then you can tune in and come back and fit in with what he would
like to know. But if you just throw out a question like, "What is
the best thing for us to do?" How are you going to answer a question
like that? You can't tune into it without some broader introspection.
RM: Of course, obvsiously one of the things that occupies me is an
improvement of a method of teaching people to operate in this less
gross body because I have only my limited span which may not be
applicable to all and yet there must be some fairly standard procedures
that can be followed.
au: Yes.
RM: And this is of course my deep interest because I feel it is
important.
Ji: If that is your interest, then that is what we should go into
because I am here to assist you.
RM: I feel that the reason is that I believe that in itself could
serve as a tool for the expansion of the personality of very many
people.
JL: Oh, yes. Just think about how much it broadens ones life and
viewpoint in itself.
RM: This is precisely what I mean and I know that my techniques as
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such are very crude and they are imperical in themselves from the sense
that they don't necessarily seem to relate to anybody else's reported
practices in the past.
JL: And they need not necessarily need to do that...to relate to
other people, People do things differently.
RM: If we could get more to the base of that. If we could help other
people to achieve that more simply and practically, I think this does
help because simply it does take them beyond this particular energy
system as it does me. It increases their awareness and cannot help
as they live here on
but expand the total concepts of our human race /f this particular
physical reality. But how to do this more efficiently. There seem
to be many methods openand I talk to let you perceive and then respond
when you feel like it. The methods that seem open we keep looking
for environmental methods that will set up an atmosphere whether it
is a mental set or a phyScbhlogical set that will enhance a person's
ability to form this consciously that I think is the important thing
again to control it willfully rather than to control it.
JL: I think you hve a good point there. That is extremely important
to be able to do it consciously. Because in tontrol then he is able
to seek out specific areas and operate in specific areas. If he doesn't
do it Bhimself consciously as a second person asking him questions, then
he is really not in control of himself. He flutters here and there
according to what comes into the mind of the person asking the questions.
However, in working with the person at the present time, I am sure that
we can get our two minds close enough together so that we pypass that
difficulty and that the two minds working and seeking the same answers
then they can go right to the point. I haven't forgotten that you are
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trying to find some means of bringing or educating or teaching an
individual to control and expand himself and that you have already
tried many things and have apparatus to apply to it...electronic
equipment etc. Normally I would be talking more on those factors, but
knowing that you have already gone into that both in your mind and fact,
is one reason why I have occasionally or most of the time branched into
the non-specific equipment, the electronic areas, to talk about the
supplementary areas within the individual himself which must be
controlled. And I think that this always will be the case, that you
are dealing with individuals and their minds and their systems and
electronic devices are really quite supplementary to this. And if
you discuss it in this manner...how does one bring other individuals
into a training program, we will do it by being in touch mentally with
them. In your tapes this does it to a certain extent with them. They
follow the Yoice in the tapes and gradually do the things they are
guided to do with background in the tapes, but after they have learned
themselves and where they are and taken a few steps forward in the
field, this tape alone becomes sterile because the other individuals
mind is really not present with them when the tape is played. Does
this make sense to you?
RM: Yes, in essence and all that we are trying to create is no more
than help the student get in a position where he can perform these
things and it is very true from there own. It is true that it is
muchly on his own, but to get him to that state. There are several
avenues open that I realy do not know about. Meaning enough to really
tend to be authoratative. That a lot of spontaneous out of body
experiences have been created by drugs and to classify the anpisteties
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and it would appear that the use of anesthesia under conditions where
it is not intensive situation first of all such an operation or
unders conditions of pain about to undergo surgery, if this in itself
has created an out-of-body condition within a person, then would not
this be one of the doorways that would be used with a subject to
at least get him acquainted with where he is so that he learns from
actually experiencing it. This is one of the questions that I pose.
JL: This is a very normal way whether it is anesthesia or a knock
on the head. Those things do tend to bring the individual out of his
normal state and make him aware of other fields of influence. I too
am not aware of the drug side of the thing because I have not gone into
that. I have not taken drugs and it seems to me nonessential and
this type of thing and I can see that it would be quite helpful in
deadening the normal body reactions and functions so that the mind
can forget that.
RM: It would seem this would be an integral part of our existence
so therefore it is not an uncommon thing for an individual to do.
Therefore, it is not an uncommon thing and if we can bring it into
the conscious level for conscious control, then the question is, how
to do this. In our dialogue we can make a triloge and ask a third
party if there is an easier or more definite way to perform this.
or easier route than we are taking?
I don't know what you knew by this. Many techniques have come to
my mind when we were talking to add to it. We are still concentraging
on out of body experiences and therefore we have to identify a meaning
to ourselves on out of body experience because I think now at this point
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at least we are not talking about the out of body experiences that you
have discussed in the past. You are takking about saying that the
individual is going to undergo the experience under the guidance of
others and be completely aware of what he is doing. There is something
peyond. At least it is out of body sensing that we are involved in.
We can go thru the gamut of viewing things at a distance and describing
them which is a parallel to out of body travel.-..a sensing of anther
location. This is the more directly...to the out of body traveling
experiences and where the individual or both individuals are interested
in describing something normally. Something physical in appearance.
However, in the knowledge category, it is somewhat different where
you travel to a field of knowledge or information or background and
you walk in and you sense 411 this informatinn that is there. You
know that it is there you can see that it is there and you can talk
and describe it but you have to make your own mind to have it brought
out into your system, There is travel to areas of knowledge and
information and there is travel to a location. And quite often the
two are combined of course but I think it is necessary as far as
an individual is concerned to identify the type of thing that is to
be done.
RM: Yes, I see what you mean. What I think is. I speak of it from...
how I know it, There seems to be this thing that one can see or perceive
at a distance which is not what I would define as out of body. I
think of it as and know of it as something very discrete. When one
is away from their physical...one's self...and acting dependently
still you yourself have total me...
JL: I think you for bringing it out in that manner. It still points
up that which of these categories are you interested in now. I am intereste|
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in this as it is my field of experience. I of course realize that...
JL: In the discreet...suppose in talking to you...suppose I would
go into a real out of body while I am here. This is an entirely...
it requires an entirely different type of communication. How would
you be aware that I was in the real out of body experience.
RM: At my own personal level...I know of no way that I can perceive
this at this time. The only way thatI have actively been able to satisfy
my own self is that it is an was a discreet situation.
JL: You have never recorded on a tape during an out of body experience?
RM: I think I have made some attempts to do so, but I have tried a
number of times to make my vocal system in my physical body work...
JL: The voaal system seems to tie in morewwhen you have the verbal
contact like we have now because it opens up this system and I have
notices that without someone to talk to that I naturally stop talking
and just go looking and experiencing the thoughts without putting
them into my voice because there was no demand for that voice angle
in it. Yet, I think that one key here is to listen to voices outside
oneself and as you listen to the voices outside of yourself learn
to put this into actual sound as you listen to them. This is...you
either can detect the difference immediately once you are in tat
situation because the transmission of the thought comes to you more
rapidly than you can operate your voice to put it into sound. And
you find yourself just as I am doing now stuttering around or talking
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more rapidly but you are completely aware of the fact that there is
a some kind of tape that is all wound up there and you have already